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	<title>Comments on: GMing Products at GenCon 2007</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007</link>
	<description>Game mastering advice, ideas &#038; resources &#8226; Dedicated to helping GMs</description>
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		<title>By: Bira</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-13234</link>
		<dc:creator>Bira</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Sep 2007 01:53:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-13234</guid>
		<description>I was reading up on the Campaign Coins, and I loooove the idea of having some real treasure to throw on the table for the gamers, or as a gamer the possibility of being able to really see and pick up the treasure you find. but the price is way to much for me, and there would be no way that the players would really be able to keep any of the coins of what they find which is what I would want to be able to do, unless you have alot of money to burn through. So naturally I went on ebay looking for something similar perhaps, but much cheaper, and I found &lt;a href=&quot;http://cgi.ebay.com/25-metal-GOLD-COINS-fantasy-D-D-RPG-LARP-Campaign-money_W0QQitemZ250170096078QQihZ015QQcategoryZ2544QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem&quot;&gt;this listing&lt;/a&gt;, so thought I&#039;d share my findings with everyone else. Good Gaming!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was reading up on the Campaign Coins, and I loooove the idea of having some real treasure to throw on the table for the gamers, or as a gamer the possibility of being able to really see and pick up the treasure you find. but the price is way to much for me, and there would be no way that the players would really be able to keep any of the coins of what they find which is what I would want to be able to do, unless you have alot of money to burn through. So naturally I went on ebay looking for something similar perhaps, but much cheaper, and I found <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/25-metal-GOLD-COINS-fantasy-D-D-RPG-LARP-Campaign-money_W0QQitemZ250170096078QQihZ015QQcategoryZ2544QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem">this listing</a>, so thought I&#8217;d share my findings with everyone else. Good Gaming!</p>
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		<title>By: Telas</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12674</link>
		<dc:creator>Telas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2007 16:44:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12674</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the math, Alan.  Now I&#039;m really glad I got two sets. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the math, Alan.  Now I&#8217;m really glad I got two sets. <img src='http://www.treasuretables.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Alan De Smet</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12662</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan De Smet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:10:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12662</guid>
		<description>With each set of Campaign Coins you get four sets of coins.  Each set has 10 &quot;1&quot;s, 10 &quot;10&quot;s, 5 &quot;100&quot;s, and 5 &quot;1,000s&quot;. You also get a single &quot;500&quot; coin from one of the four sets.  This means that for three of the four sets, you can&#039;t generate values which include 611 through 999 as the last three digits.  An unfortunate omission.  If you got a &quot;500&quot; coin for all four sets that would solve the problem, allowing you to generate any number from 1 through 6,110.

Per the previous post, I&#039;ve been thinking of using the Gamemastery item cards, maybe supplemented with the Tokkens for exceptional items, for treasures.  The coins seem a natural addition.  Being able to say, &quot;Here&#039;s what you find&quot; and dumping a pile of stuff on the table is very, very appealing.

Unfortunately part of the appeal is that the cards solve much of the item tracking problem where an item in a treasure will either end up on no-one&#039;s character sheets, or on multiple sheets.  However, I&#039;m not sure how useful this is for the coins, since the the PCs will likely want to split the coins roughly eveningly, which will be problematic for some combinations.  To take a simple example, you can hand four players 28 gold pieces in the form of 8 &quot;1&quot;s and 2 &quot;10&quot;s, but if they evenly split it, each will each need 7 &quot;1&quot;s, a total of 28 &quot;1&quot;s, which you can&#039;t do.

I&#039;ll probably give it a whirl for my next D&amp;D game, since they are so appealing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With each set of Campaign Coins you get four sets of coins.  Each set has 10 &#8220;1&#8243;s, 10 &#8220;10&#8243;s, 5 &#8220;100&#8243;s, and 5 &#8220;1,000s&#8221;. You also get a single &#8220;500&#8243; coin from one of the four sets.  This means that for three of the four sets, you can&#8217;t generate values which include 611 through 999 as the last three digits.  An unfortunate omission.  If you got a &#8220;500&#8243; coin for all four sets that would solve the problem, allowing you to generate any number from 1 through 6,110.</p>
<p>Per the previous post, I&#8217;ve been thinking of using the Gamemastery item cards, maybe supplemented with the Tokkens for exceptional items, for treasures.  The coins seem a natural addition.  Being able to say, &#8220;Here&#8217;s what you find&#8221; and dumping a pile of stuff on the table is very, very appealing.</p>
<p>Unfortunately part of the appeal is that the cards solve much of the item tracking problem where an item in a treasure will either end up on no-one&#8217;s character sheets, or on multiple sheets.  However, I&#8217;m not sure how useful this is for the coins, since the the PCs will likely want to split the coins roughly eveningly, which will be problematic for some combinations.  To take a simple example, you can hand four players 28 gold pieces in the form of 8 &#8220;1&#8243;s and 2 &#8220;10&#8243;s, but if they evenly split it, each will each need 7 &#8220;1&#8243;s, a total of 28 &#8220;1&#8243;s, which you can&#8217;t do.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll probably give it a whirl for my next D&amp;D game, since they are so appealing.</p>
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		<title>By: Dungeon Mastering &#187; 7 props for your D&#38;D game</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12645</link>
		<dc:creator>Dungeon Mastering &#187; 7 props for your D&#38;D game</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 13:01:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12645</guid>
		<description>[...] Gold pieces - real ones! Check out the Campaign Coins website. I learned about these thanks to this Treasure Tables post about GenCon products. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Gold pieces &#8211; real ones! Check out the Campaign Coins website. I learned about these thanks to this Treasure Tables post about GenCon products. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan O\'Donnell</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12644</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan O\'Donnell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 06:03:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12644</guid>
		<description>As someone who knows Andre (who makes Campaign Coins), I think he did it to add to the atmosphere in his campaign. He wanted good coins, so he went out and got them made.  The product is a result.

@Martin: don&#039;t forget that you can always travel to a country that is experiencing hyper-inflation and get real money.  But generally it is only paper money, good for Monopoly and Cheap-ass Games.  People used to do that when travelling to Eastern Europe, for example.  Of course, your trip comes with all the issues that a country experiencing hyper-inflation has, but it can make for interesting times.

I&#039;ve played one demo game of Dread, and I loved it.  The Jenga tower really increases the tension.  It provides a great way to make players seriously consider the risk involved in their character&#039;s actions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who knows Andre (who makes Campaign Coins), I think he did it to add to the atmosphere in his campaign. He wanted good coins, so he went out and got them made.  The product is a result.</p>
<p>@Martin: don&#8217;t forget that you can always travel to a country that is experiencing hyper-inflation and get real money.  But generally it is only paper money, good for Monopoly and Cheap-ass Games.  People used to do that when travelling to Eastern Europe, for example.  Of course, your trip comes with all the issues that a country experiencing hyper-inflation has, but it can make for interesting times.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve played one demo game of Dread, and I loved it.  The Jenga tower really increases the tension.  It provides a great way to make players seriously consider the risk involved in their character&#8217;s actions.</p>
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		<title>By: John Arcadian</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12643</link>
		<dc:creator>John Arcadian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 03:04:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12643</guid>
		<description>Jason said &quot;I don’t know about $150 for the Dragonfire Airship. At those prices, and with a little work, you could easily make a 3D one on your own for easily 1/3 of the cost that would look so much better.&quot;

I highly see where you are coming from, but there is so much to that airship that isn&#039;t conveyed from just a picture. I saw it at origins, and it has about 4 (maybe 6) levels to it, so you can pull them out and have action going on each section.  It has multiples smaller pieces ( like railings, foredeck, raised areas, etc) that layer into the main ones to show different heights. The side pieces, wings, and fins also come off of it as well, so it can be a big ship.  For my money it is much easier to go with a picture, a map, or a home built, but that thing was pretty damn cool in itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jason said &#8220;I don’t know about $150 for the Dragonfire Airship. At those prices, and with a little work, you could easily make a 3D one on your own for easily 1/3 of the cost that would look so much better.&#8221;</p>
<p>I highly see where you are coming from, but there is so much to that airship that isn&#8217;t conveyed from just a picture. I saw it at origins, and it has about 4 (maybe 6) levels to it, so you can pull them out and have action going on each section.  It has multiples smaller pieces ( like railings, foredeck, raised areas, etc) that layer into the main ones to show different heights. The side pieces, wings, and fins also come off of it as well, so it can be a big ship.  For my money it is much easier to go with a picture, a map, or a home built, but that thing was pretty damn cool in itself.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12636</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 19:14:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12636</guid>
		<description>I really like the stackable counters from Alea Tools. They work great for elevations. I can pick a color (I use dark blue)to equal each ten feet. Stack them up, put the mini on top and your ready to go. This things are like crack to me. These guys are from Colorado and are at all of our local cons and I buy some from them every con. Here&#039;s there site.
http://www.aleatools.com/Default.aspx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really like the stackable counters from Alea Tools. They work great for elevations. I can pick a color (I use dark blue)to equal each ten feet. Stack them up, put the mini on top and your ready to go. This things are like crack to me. These guys are from Colorado and are at all of our local cons and I buy some from them every con. Here&#8217;s there site.<br />
<a href="http://www.aleatools.com/Default.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://www.aleatools.com/Default.aspx</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12635</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 18:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12635</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know about $150 for the Dragonfire Airship. At those prices, and with a little work, you could easily make a 3D one on your own for easily 1/3 of the cost that would look so much better. Especially if your campaign features the airship as a centerpiece or the main mode of transportation for the player characters. Just my two-cents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know about $150 for the Dragonfire Airship. At those prices, and with a little work, you could easily make a 3D one on your own for easily 1/3 of the cost that would look so much better. Especially if your campaign features the airship as a centerpiece or the main mode of transportation for the player characters. Just my two-cents.</p>
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		<title>By: Telas</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12633</link>
		<dc:creator>Telas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 17:26:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12633</guid>
		<description>Some answers, from an prop-addicted GM (who admittedly hasn&#039;t used them yet).

Every player gets a tupperware box and a pouch.  Coins go in the pouch, pouch goes in the box at end of game (along with the magic item cards, potion vials, dice, mini, etc).  Box stays with the GM.

Most of the coins have too much relief to stack.  And it&#039;s just like the dice towers - &quot;Would you please not do that?&quot; ;)

If another player steals your loot, I guess that&#039;s an opportunity to game it out.  If I&#039;m the player getting stolen from, the &quot;thief&quot; learns &lt;i&gt;why we don&#039;t steal from melee builds&lt;/i&gt;.  

OK seriously... I give out items representing potions, scrolls, and magic items.  They&#039;ve never been stolen.  

However, all that said, it totally depends on the group.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some answers, from an prop-addicted GM (who admittedly hasn&#8217;t used them yet).</p>
<p>Every player gets a tupperware box and a pouch.  Coins go in the pouch, pouch goes in the box at end of game (along with the magic item cards, potion vials, dice, mini, etc).  Box stays with the GM.</p>
<p>Most of the coins have too much relief to stack.  And it&#8217;s just like the dice towers &#8211; &#8220;Would you please not do that?&#8221; <img src='http://www.treasuretables.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>If another player steals your loot, I guess that&#8217;s an opportunity to game it out.  If I&#8217;m the player getting stolen from, the &#8220;thief&#8221; learns <i>why we don&#8217;t steal from melee builds</i>.  </p>
<p>OK seriously&#8230; I give out items representing potions, scrolls, and magic items.  They&#8217;ve never been stolen.  </p>
<p>However, all that said, it totally depends on the group.</p>
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		<title>By: Abulia</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12632</link>
		<dc:creator>Abulia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 16:03:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12632</guid>
		<description>I think I would find these annoying. :)

First, it&#039;s another resource I have to track. As if I don&#039;t have enough of that in D&amp;D already. Instead of writing down that I have 22 pp, 16 gp, 10 sp, and 33 cp now I have a stack of what, 30 coins in front of me?

Like players who build towers of dice I see the same problem with the coins. Now I have coin towers, players rolling them across the table at each other or just &quot;clinking&quot; them together.

Mechanically, the session is over and we all go home. Do I keep the coins or give them to the DM? Now all the players have the DMs product. Do they get lost? If you return them then what&#039;s the point in the first place? Now I have to write down my money, defeating the purpose of the &quot;immersion&quot; coins.

At a megagame level if you walk away from the table to get a drink and the &quot;thief&quot; character takes the coins off the table, were you &quot;stolen&quot; from? Do you get to make a Spot check? Finders keepers?

Yea, I&#039;m sure they&#039;re cool looking and feel great but the reality is, in practice, I see these as being useless in a game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I would find these annoying. <img src='http://www.treasuretables.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>First, it&#8217;s another resource I have to track. As if I don&#8217;t have enough of that in D&amp;D already. Instead of writing down that I have 22 pp, 16 gp, 10 sp, and 33 cp now I have a stack of what, 30 coins in front of me?</p>
<p>Like players who build towers of dice I see the same problem with the coins. Now I have coin towers, players rolling them across the table at each other or just &#8220;clinking&#8221; them together.</p>
<p>Mechanically, the session is over and we all go home. Do I keep the coins or give them to the DM? Now all the players have the DMs product. Do they get lost? If you return them then what&#8217;s the point in the first place? Now I have to write down my money, defeating the purpose of the &#8220;immersion&#8221; coins.</p>
<p>At a megagame level if you walk away from the table to get a drink and the &#8220;thief&#8221; character takes the coins off the table, were you &#8220;stolen&#8221; from? Do you get to make a Spot check? Finders keepers?</p>
<p>Yea, I&#8217;m sure they&#8217;re cool looking and feel great but the reality is, in practice, I see these as being useless in a game.</p>
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		<title>By: Johnn</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12622</link>
		<dc:creator>Johnn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 02:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12622</guid>
		<description>longcoat000: Neat idea! Thanks - I&#039;ll quest for that game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>longcoat000: Neat idea! Thanks &#8211; I&#8217;ll quest for that game.</p>
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		<title>By: longcoat000</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/08/gming-products-at-gencon-2007/comment-page-1#comment-12621</link>
		<dc:creator>longcoat000</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Aug 2007 20:40:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=836#comment-12621</guid>
		<description>Johnn - Ever seen people at a con playing a game called Mustangs &amp; Messerschmidts(sp?)?  They simulate arial battles using dowel rods, clothespins, and model WWII airplanes.  You could use the same theory for 3D battles using plastic minis.  Balsa wood base, thin dowel rod attached, marks on dowel indicating height, short length of dowel with a spring-type clothespin on either end (one clips on the rod, the other clips to the miniature&#039;s base).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Johnn &#8211; Ever seen people at a con playing a game called Mustangs &amp; Messerschmidts(sp?)?  They simulate arial battles using dowel rods, clothespins, and model WWII airplanes.  You could use the same theory for 3D battles using plastic minis.  Balsa wood base, thin dowel rod attached, marks on dowel indicating height, short length of dowel with a spring-type clothespin on either end (one clips on the rod, the other clips to the miniature&#8217;s base).</p>
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