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	<title>Comments on: Communicate: Understand the Lessons You Will Teach Each Other</title>
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	<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other</link>
	<description>Game mastering advice, ideas &#038; resources &#8226; Dedicated to helping GMs</description>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10645</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 14:44:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10645</guid>
		<description>Hope you don&#039;t mind an additional link; like brcarl not accusing you of being derivative, but agreeing that you&#039;re making an important point. 

I&#039;ve long felt--usually every time I heard a GM complain about their &quot;problem&quot; players--that GMs often contribute to their own problems through how they reward or  punish player actions or the unspoken assumptions they put into their game world. Here are two related articles from a few years back:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.burningvoid.com/rpg/2003/condition1.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Expectations, Conditioning and Your Game: Examples&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.burningvoid.com/rpg/2003/condition2.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Expectations, Conditioning and Your Game: Rules of Thumb&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hope you don&#8217;t mind an additional link; like brcarl not accusing you of being derivative, but agreeing that you&#8217;re making an important point. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve long felt&#8211;usually every time I heard a GM complain about their &#8220;problem&#8221; players&#8211;that GMs often contribute to their own problems through how they reward or  punish player actions or the unspoken assumptions they put into their game world. Here are two related articles from a few years back:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.burningvoid.com/rpg/2003/condition1.php" rel="nofollow">Expectations, Conditioning and Your Game: Examples</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.burningvoid.com/rpg/2003/condition2.php" rel="nofollow">Expectations, Conditioning and Your Game: Rules of Thumb</a></p>
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		<title>By: brcarl</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10632</link>
		<dc:creator>brcarl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 17:31:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10632</guid>
		<description>Martin:
Thanks for covering my laziness and finding the links.

Ramza:
I apologize if I offended you with my comments.  I was not trying to belittle your insight or imply that you were plagiarizing.  As Martin correctly theorized, I was just trying to point out a part of your post that A) I had seen covered before, and B) agreed with as a point important enough to bear repeating. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martin:<br />
Thanks for covering my laziness and finding the links.</p>
<p>Ramza:<br />
I apologize if I offended you with my comments.  I was not trying to belittle your insight or imply that you were plagiarizing.  As Martin correctly theorized, I was just trying to point out a part of your post that A) I had seen covered before, and B) agreed with as a point important enough to bear repeating. <img src='http://www.treasuretables.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10623</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 01:14:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10623</guid>
		<description>I actually read brcarl&#039;s comment as &quot;This is a recurring topic on TT because it&#039;s important.&quot; Hopefully he&#039;ll pop back in to clarify.

I believe the two posts he&#039;s thinking of are &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.treasuretables.org/2005/08/getting-player-feedback&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Getting Player Feedback&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.treasuretables.org/2005/12/the-loved-blah-hated-list-a-gming-tool&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Loved, Blah, Hated List, a GMing Tool&lt;/a&gt;. Any overlap I see there is fruitful, so no worries, Ramza. Your post stands just fine on its own, and it&#039;s excellent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I actually read brcarl&#8217;s comment as &#8220;This is a recurring topic on TT because it&#8217;s important.&#8221; Hopefully he&#8217;ll pop back in to clarify.</p>
<p>I believe the two posts he&#8217;s thinking of are <a href="http://www.treasuretables.org/2005/08/getting-player-feedback" rel="nofollow">Getting Player Feedback</a> and <a href="http://www.treasuretables.org/2005/12/the-loved-blah-hated-list-a-gming-tool" rel="nofollow">The Loved, Blah, Hated List, a GMing Tool</a>. Any overlap I see there is fruitful, so no worries, Ramza. Your post stands just fine on its own, and it&#8217;s excellent.</p>
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		<title>By: Ramza</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10622</link>
		<dc:creator>Ramza</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 22:53:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10622</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;This concept has been covered here and in many other GM-advice columns.&lt;/i&gt;

Why so critical?  Especially given the subsequent lack of links pointing out where I cribbed the post from.  I will respond as dispassionately as possible.

The concept quoted as being derivative was not the main point of my post in any event.  Most importantly, the method of analysis is different from the typical solicitation of feedback, such as a list of &#039;hits and misses&#039; from each player.  The main point of my post is a behavioral analysis.  Discussing observations of behavior, even when one&#039;s behavior is at issue, is not the same as self reporting.  Thanks VV for mentioning the behavioral aspect of the post.

This is, in no way, meant to diminish the power of self reporting; only to distinguish from the behavioral analysis.  The suggested &#039;hits and misses&#039; tool is a good one and I mention it only in response to the first comment.

This guest posting thing is hard on the ego!  

Later.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>This concept has been covered here and in many other GM-advice columns.</i></p>
<p>Why so critical?  Especially given the subsequent lack of links pointing out where I cribbed the post from.  I will respond as dispassionately as possible.</p>
<p>The concept quoted as being derivative was not the main point of my post in any event.  Most importantly, the method of analysis is different from the typical solicitation of feedback, such as a list of &#8216;hits and misses&#8217; from each player.  The main point of my post is a behavioral analysis.  Discussing observations of behavior, even when one&#8217;s behavior is at issue, is not the same as self reporting.  Thanks VV for mentioning the behavioral aspect of the post.</p>
<p>This is, in no way, meant to diminish the power of self reporting; only to distinguish from the behavioral analysis.  The suggested &#8216;hits and misses&#8217; tool is a good one and I mention it only in response to the first comment.</p>
<p>This guest posting thing is hard on the ego!  </p>
<p>Later.</p>
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		<title>By: VV_GM</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10621</link>
		<dc:creator>VV_GM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 21:40:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10621</guid>
		<description>I like the part about the GM recognizing bad player behaviour, and then asking him or herself what does he or she do to reward/encourage such behaviour. Too often it is easy to just blame the player, but it really is a two way street where the GM may have to change techniques in order to get the results desired.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the part about the GM recognizing bad player behaviour, and then asking him or herself what does he or she do to reward/encourage such behaviour. Too often it is easy to just blame the player, but it really is a two way street where the GM may have to change techniques in order to get the results desired.</p>
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		<title>By: brcarl</title>
		<link>http://www.treasuretables.org/2007/05/communicate-understand-the-lessons-you-will-teach-each-other/comment-page-1#comment-10616</link>
		<dc:creator>brcarl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 16:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.treasuretables.org/?p=712#comment-10616</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;In such a group, a little record keeping will establish a clear history and insight into exactly what everyone likes and dislikes, regardless of what they claim those things to be.&lt;/i&gt;

This concept has been covered here and in many other GM-advice columns.  Again I am lazy with the linkage, but I recall good notes here at TT about soliciting feedback from your players.  One of my favorite suggestions along these lines is to take a few minutes at the end of each session and get from each player a list of &quot;hits&quot; (stuff they liked) and &quot;misses&quot; (stuff they didn&#039;t like).

If you&#039;re really good at task-juggling and self-assessment, you might even be able to capture this kind of information during play, without prompting the players.  Body language and tone often say more than words, and a perceptive GM will know when a player is jonesing or bumming.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>In such a group, a little record keeping will establish a clear history and insight into exactly what everyone likes and dislikes, regardless of what they claim those things to be.</i></p>
<p>This concept has been covered here and in many other GM-advice columns.  Again I am lazy with the linkage, but I recall good notes here at TT about soliciting feedback from your players.  One of my favorite suggestions along these lines is to take a few minutes at the end of each session and get from each player a list of &#8220;hits&#8221; (stuff they liked) and &#8220;misses&#8221; (stuff they didn&#8217;t like).</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re really good at task-juggling and self-assessment, you might even be able to capture this kind of information during play, without prompting the players.  Body language and tone often say more than words, and a perceptive GM will know when a player is jonesing or bumming.</p>
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